Proofreading Service - Pain in the English
Proofreading Service - Pain in the English

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Proofreading Service - Pain in the English
Proofreading Service - Pain in the English

Your Pain Is Our Pleasure

24-Hour Proofreading Service—We proofread your Google Docs or Microsoft Word files. We hate grammatical errors with a passion. Learn More

“Anglish”

Has anyone come across “Anglish”? Anglish or Saxon is described as “...a form of English linguistic purism, which favours words of native (Germanic) origin over those of foreign (mainly Romance and Greek) origin.”

Does anybody have an opinion or thoughts on “Anglish”...

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Yes but keep in mind that "highte" is sort of passive in meaning so it cannot have a true object that is you cannot highte something; whereas cite is a true yoking verb. It's like heissen in German: it is already "passive" in meaning: Ich heisse, not Ich bin gehiessen or something..
It does sound right in the foregoing instances though.

jayles Nov-09-2011

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While Chaucer may have been using in a passive sense; the verb is both yoking and yokeless:

Hight \Hight\, v. t. & i. [imp. Hight, Hot, p. p. Hight, Hote (?), Hoten (?). See Hote.] [ME. heiten, highten, haten, hoten; also hight, hatte, hette, is called, was called, AS. h[=a]tan to call, name, be called, to command, promise; also h[=a]tte is called, was called; akin to G. heissen to call, be called, bid, Goth. haitan to call, in the passive, to be called.]
1. To be called or named. [Archaic & Poetic.]

Note: In the form hight, it is used in a passive sense as a
present, meaning is called or named, also as a
preterite, was called or named. This form has also been
used as a past participle. See Hote.

The great poet of Italy, That highte Dante.
--Chaucer.

Bright was her hue, and Geraldine she hight.
--Surrey.

Entered then into the church the Reverend
Teacher. Father he hight, and he was, in the
parish. --Longfellow.

Childe Harold was he hight. --Byron.

2. To command; to direct; to impel. [Obs.]

But the sad steel seized not where it was hight Upon
the child, but somewhat short did fall. --Spenser.

3. To commit; to intrust. [Obs.]

Yet charge of them was to a porter hight. --Spenser.

4. To promise. [Obs.]

He had hold his day, as he had hight. --Chaucer.

AnWulf Nov-09-2011

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@Ængelfolc ... rank, range, ranch ... but not rankle! Which is akin to dragon ... Odd! lol

AnWulf Nov-13-2011

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"The right to bare arms"
(misunderstood in the North as "The right to bear-arms" ) !

jayles Nov-14-2011

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Seems that there is a Dutch version of Anglish ... And it has been umbe much longer than Anglish!

Welkom op het thuisblad van BTL, de Bond tegen Leenwoorden!
http://bondtegenleenwoorden.nl/

AnWulf Nov-14-2011

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Well I'v found a few more words:

1. snape = criticize, rebuke
2. tofall (also to-fall) = close (n) ... "the tofall of the day"
3. tocome = arrival, future ... guess that is as close as I'll get to Zukunft
4. to-be = future
5. bewreke (bewreak) = avenge, revenge

AnWulf Nov-17-2011

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This one deserves a bit of thought. Read/rede ... they share a PIE root with reason (from Fr. resoun) which I put forth is why the word reason was brooked and spelled as reason ... a merging of the two. (I can't prove it ... but see below).

From OE:
ræswum dp. of *r ̄æs? or r ̄æsu? f. or *r ̄æswa? suggestion, deliberation, counsel
ræswung f. reasoning, conjecture

ræd became read/rede ... and we'v see the 'w' drop out of swutel so maybe reaswum (kind of hard to say) or reasum (the French scribes would hav changed the 'u' to an 'o' ... reasom ... swap the 'n' from resoun ... reason ... Which is how I think it became 'reason'. ... Sooo ... Why not take it to the more Anglo spelling of reasum? It's so close to what we hav now that I think it would more reddily be accepted ... Any thoughts?

On to a different word ... "foredraft" ... What does that suggest to you? It's a calque of a Dutch word and was put forth for "proposal". There is an old meaning for the word "saw" that means "proposal, suggestion" as well. Well brooked in ME as such.

I have a foredraft for you.
I have a saw for you. ... Sounds like I'm handing yu a cutting instrument ...

One more ... steven. No, not the name but the noun and verb. Ever heard it? It has many meanings. ... Including to vote!

AnWulf Nov-18-2011

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steven (n) "voice, command, constitution; also, "an outcry; a loud call; a clamor"; "To set steven, to make an appointment" < O.E. stefn, stemn < P.Gmc *stebnō, *stemnō , *stabnjaz, *stabnjēn (see Gothic stibna "voice"; German Stimme; O.N. stefna; O.Sax stemna "voice"; O.Fris. stifne; O.E. stæf (staff), German Stab, Swedish stav)

"Ye have as merry a steven, As any angel hath that is in heaven."- Chaucer.

"They setten steven for to meet, To playen at the dice." - Chaucer.

Not akin to the name STEPHAN, STEVEN.

Ængelfolc Nov-20-2011

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Well, I'v found out today that "foreset" is still in play in English. Foreset in OE to place before, shut in, propose, prefer, precede. ['foreset']. We had bepoken (discussed) of this some time back. In ME foresetten and there was a foresetting was brooked as "something which is set forth". Foreset matches up well with voorstel (Du and Afrik). There is still, and likely always will be, befuddlement between forset (to hinder, block) and foreset (to propose, set before).

A suggestion or proposal could be a foreset, foresetting, or foreset(t)ness.

There also seems to be a trend of brooking "fortake" for "partake". After I thought about it, it seems ok. For- is an intensifier (tho usually in a negative sense) ... So it would be intensifing take ... "I personally don't fortake in the green beer drinking festivities for St. Patrick's Day" ... I can liv with that.

AnWulf Nov-20-2011

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Another on that has been bothering me but I think I'm near to an answer is "because". Cause is a Latinate.

OE had forðæm, forðâm, forðan, forðon I. conj. for (the reason) that, owing to (the fact) that, for, because, on that account, therefore, seeing that. for ðæm ðe, etc. with same signification. II. adv. for that cause, consequently, therefore.

Also forthen, forthe in ME

forthan, forthen, forthe ... but I want to say forthat ... like omdat, doordat (Du), fordi (Dan). Thoughts?


I kno that I can brook "owing to" here but that's not the ord (point).

AnWulf Nov-20-2011

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"for" meaning because is still brooked as a conjunction today, although formal. Appears in the the Beatles song hey Jude "For well you know that it's just you...".
The other words in today's usage are "as" and "since", though "since" is quite academic.

jayles Nov-20-2011

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Today, looking at a news article for students to discuss, I found it overfull of latinate words. So I changed "calibrate" to "link", "revered" to "well-looked-up-to" and so forth.
It is a tricky job to come down on which words to edit out, that is which words are not needed by English-learners at this stage. However the truly hard task is to come up with a better stand-in when there is only ten minutes left before the class starts!

jayles Nov-20-2011

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The other thing is knowing which words are truly latinate when there is no time to check. I'm hoping "link" is good; "scant" like- so many words beginning "sc" is from Norse; but so many such as "task" could be from anywhere. How are people supposed to know instantly????

jayles Nov-20-2011

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Yes, knowing which words are Latinates can sometimes be hard. French sometimes does a good job of hiding the roots, huru if it came into French when they were still more Frank than French. Task is one of those. It shares the same root as tax and is thought to be a corruption of the word tax. Ger. tasche "pocket" is from the same V.L. source (via O.H.G. tasca). Maybe Ængelfolc can pull a Germanic upspringing out his books.

revered ... highly thought of? Maybe that isn't strong enuff ...

Link, itself, is good to go. I brook it ... and bind ... for join, connect ... my link/binding (connection) to the net.

For calibrate ... set? ... tweak.

Anent because, I can often get umbe (around) it with since, for, owing to ... I was looking for that one word to bestead it.

I could let hav my worksheet that I keep. However, I don't think I would teach some of the old words to outlanders. Too many erd-English speakers don't kno them!

Sadly too, many don't know the forefasts well and befuddle words like forgo and forego. :shrug:

AnWulf Nov-21-2011

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"Maybe Ængelfolc can pull a Germanic upspringing out his books." For which words?

"if it came into French when they were still more Frank than French." Yes, you are right. And, don't forget, the Norse had great bearing on French, too.

* screen < O.N.Fr. escren, O.Fr. escran < Frankish *skrank (Polish gets its word ekran "screen" directly from French)

* busk (n.) "strip of wood, whalebone, etc., used in corset-making," < Fr. busc, from It. bosco < W.Gmc. *busk (whence also bush, rebuke, asf)

* brush < O.Fr. broisse < V.L. *bruscia < Proto-Germanic *bruskaz “underbrush”

And, there are many, many other hidden Teutonic words that came through N.Fr and even Latin!

MOST, but not all, words ending with "-sk" are Teutonic/Norse. Task, Musk, Skeleton, Sketch, Skete, and Cask are a few of the Teutonic looking un-Teutonic words. The good thing is that these words are said in a heavily Teutonic way; this is also why they can hide amongst the other Teutonic words so easily.

Ængelfolc Nov-21-2011

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"However, I don't think I would teach some of the old words to outlanders. " I agree wholeheartedly. However, where learners are just beginning to read newspapers they are flooded with new wordstock. Truely English stand-in words make it easier for them to get started. Of course, "calibrated" is doubtless in Portugese/Spanish/French/Italian/ & Romanian, but for the rest of the world taking it out is a blessing.
Which begs the ask, why do it all the time??

jayles Nov-21-2011

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Bemoaning my fate yet again.... "Collocations" is not a word I knew before I started teaching English. It means "Mitwoerter", (I've invented that), that is words which go together such as: afraid of; keen on; succeed in; ask for; and so forth. One of the hurdles to requickening old words is that the collocations do not readily come to mind. We need lots of examples to take in how to use a word.
Anyway, what a pain it is to uncloud this word .... having pointed out the root "locations"
we get to "col". Point out that this is a form of "con", latin for "together" or "with"......and suddenly we're teaching Latin not English! And writing on the board a more English phrase "Placed together", which everyone understands. (OK so place is Normanesque but it's been in English awhile now.) So I come face to face with "Anglish" every day.

jayles Nov-21-2011

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@jayles:

PLACE (O.E. plæce) might be okay, even though it took out O.E. stow and stede from the everyday wordstock. It is from Greek plateîa, and came into English before the year 950 A.D.

Ængelfolc Nov-21-2011

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@Jayles ... At first I thought that yu had misspelled co-locate but then I acknew (realized) that it was a different word, albeit that means the same thing. Ængelfolc is right that place is a Greek-rooted word that came into the tung fore-1066. But it wisly* (certainly) is an eath one to bestead (replace). For the verb to place - to put or to set.

So collocations are words that are put/set together. Maybe the noun itself would be togetherness, togethership, or togetherwise.

My other new word for tonight is seldseen (rare) ... it's in the wordbooks (except for the OED!). Collocation is a seldseen word!

*wis, iwis, ywis from OE gewis, gewiss meaning sure(ly), certain(ly), really, truly ... as verb: To imagine, ween; deem, know, think, suppose (I rather like the old spelling of gewiss.)

AnWulf Nov-21-2011

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Here's a word that I just found ... undeadliness (immortality). We all kno about the undead and now we kno about undeadliness!

And for a vision / dream ... sweven (foresight works too I think)

Another word for sound, noise, clamor ... lude.

If you need a word for suggestion/proposal ... foreset.

AnWulf Nov-22-2011

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In German today, we still say and write "gewiss". Again, this shows what close kin English and German are:

M.E. wis, iwis (see O.N. viss < Icelandic: viss, Swedish: viss,
Danish: vis) < O.E. ġewiss < O.Sax., OHG gewiss, giwis < PGmc. *gawissaz

"He was wis on his word"

As an adverb > miþ ġewisse "especially"

Ængelfolc Nov-22-2011

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@AnWulf:

Why not keep "dream"? < O.E. drēam, O.N. draumr

Ængelfolc Nov-22-2011

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@Ængelfolc ... dream is good for what happens in yur sleep. A vision is sunder. A vision may come to yu in yur dreams or it may come to yu while yu'r awake so there needs to be another word for it and sweven works. It's not for the actual vision of eyesight ... that is sight/eyesight.

Lude also shows kinship. It has the same root as loud, alt spellings for lude were loude, lood, luid (Scots)

Lude

AnWulf Nov-23-2011

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@jayles: ""scant" like- so many words beginning "sc" is from Norse" > most of the "sc-" and "sk-" words are. The words that are not Norse are few, but tricky (< Old Dutch *trekkan, *trekan), like SCALD < O.N.F. escalder < L.L. excaldare "hot water bath". When an sc-/sk- word in unknown, likely Old Norse is its home!

The thought that English doesn't have a great many Norse words is wrong (O.N. (v)rangr)! Further, many words of Norman-French origin in English are from Old Norse, too. Here are a few tokens:

SCANT < O.N. skamt < O.N. skammr "short"

SCARE < O.N. skirra "to frighten" < O.N. skjarr "timid, shy"

SCREAM < Old English *scrǣman < O.N. skraumi/skræma (see West Frisian skrieme to weep)

SCREETCH < O.N. skrækja "to screech"

SCREAK < O.N. skrækja "to screech"

SCRATCH (Satan) < Old English scritta (maybe *scratta); akin with O.N. skratti "devil, goblin, wizard", O.H.G. skraz "wood-demon"

SCRAP/SCRAPPY < O.N. skrap < O.N. skrapa "to scrape"

SCRAWNY < Norwegian skran "lean" < maybe from O.N.skrælna

SCREE < O.N. skritha "landslide"

SCRAG/SCRAGGY/SCRAGGILY < O.N. N. skrekka, skroejkkja (see Norwegian skragg (a lean person), dialectical Swedish skragge, Frisian/Danish skrog)

SCRAPE < O.E.scrapian/ O.N. skrapa

SKIVE/ SKIVER < O.N. skīfa "slice"

SKITTLE < O.N. skutill "shuttle, arrow" (akin to Danish skytte)

SKITTISH/ SKITE/ SKEET < O.N. skýt-, stem of skjóta "to shoot"

SKEG < O.N. skegg "projection on the stern of a boat"

SKALD < O.N. skāld "poet"

SCAB < O.N. skabb scab, itch

SCAR "a precipitous, rocky place; cliff; a low or submerged rock in the sea" < O.N. sker "low reef"

SKERRY "a small, rocky island; a coastline with a series of such islands offshore" < O.N. sker "low reef"

SCAR "mark left by a healed wound" < M.E. skar (O.Sax skard) < O.N. skarð(r) "notch, chink, gap" with some bearing from O.Fr escare "scab"

SCATHE < O.N. skathi/skatha "damage, harm"

SCALP < O.N. skālpr "sheath"

SKIN < O.N. skinn

SKIFFLE < O.N. skipta

SKILLET < O.N. skjōla

SKIM < O.N. skum likely through O.Fr. escumer

And, many,many, many more....

Ængelfolc Nov-25-2011

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I'm not catholic so I don't hav a dog in this fight so to speak. I'm only looking at for understanding and if it is eath to read and say.

Along those lines, "maker of heaven and earth, of all that is seen and unseen" is much better than "maker of heaven and earth, of all things visible and invisible."

"When supper ended, He took the cup,” now reads, “In a similar way, when supper was ended, He took this precious chalice ..." This is better?

Same goes for "one in Being with the Father" rather than "consubstantial with the Father". Consubstantial? What buffoon thought that was more unbecloudy?

http://www.kentucky.com/2011/11/11/1955625/english-language-mass-to-change.html

AnWulf Nov-27-2011

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I saw this post on a blog:

This kind of detail of English is really interesting. Mainly for non native speakers. Nice thing in that is how easy is assume it’s meaning.
Queenlessness… I would never thing this word would be used to say something about a beehive. Firstly I would try something like a monarchy in mourning. Best wishes from Brazil!

AnWulf Nov-27-2011

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"wield" - found out that this is kin to "walten", "Gewalt", Verwaltigung and such. Somehow we should be able to use this root instead of "govern/government" , which has long been a thorn in the side of true English.

jayles Nov-27-2011

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@black jayles ... there were many words for "government" and "rule" in OE/ME that hav fallen out. Wield was one of them. On philosophical grounds, I would naysay it for "government" owing to I don't believe that gov't should "rule" or "wield" over the folk.

wield - O.E. weldan (Mercian), wieldan, wealdan (W.Saxon) "to govern, possess, have control over" (class VII strong verb; past tense weold, pp. gewealden), merged with weak verb wyldan, both from P.Gmc. *wal-t- (cf. O.S., Goth. waldan, O.Fris. walda "to govern, rule", O.N. valda "to rule, wield, to cause", O.H.G. waltan, Ger. walten "to rule, govern"), probably from PIE *waldh-, from base *wal- "to be strong, to rule". The PIE root is also the root of valiant thru Latin.

OE weald (wield) yields:
Brytenwealda m. - wielder of Britain, Bretwalda, chief king.
burhwealda m. - burgess
eallwealda - I. all-ruling, almighty. II. m. God, the Almighty.
eallwealdend m. - ruler of all, (all-wielder)
eallwealdende - 'all-wielding,' all ruling
handgeweald n. - power, possession
oferwealdan - to get the better of, to lord over (over-wield)
oferwealdend m. - over-lord, ruler
onweald - I. mfn. authority, power, rule, sway, command; jurisdiction, territory
II. adj. mighty, powerful. ['onwald'/'anwald' in ME]
onwealda m. - ruler, governor, sovereign: the Lord, God.
onwealdend m. - ruler.
+onwealdian (an-) - to have dominion over, get possession of
onwealdig - powerful.
onwealdnes f. power, possession
sundoranweald m. - single authority (also sunder-anweald)
ðrymwealdend - I. adj. all-ruling. II. m. lord of glory.
ungewilde (y) - not subject to, independent of; untamed, unbridled. [geweald] [[listed as "+weald"]]
+weald n. - might, power: control, command, dominion. his gewealdes of his own accord, intentionally: protection: subjection.
±wealdan - to rule, control, determine, direct, command, govern, possess; wield (a weapon), exercise: cause, bring about.
+wealden - I. adj. subject (to), easily controlled: inconsiderable, small.
II. adv. moderately.
wealdend (a) - I. m. leader, controller, ruler, lord, king (often of God).
II. f. female ruler.
±wealdende - ruling, powerful.
Wealdendfæder m. - Heavenly Father.
+wealdendlîce - powerfully
+wealdenmôd - self-controlled
wealdes (usu. +) - of one's own accord
wealdgenga m. - robber, thief
±wealdleðer n. - rein, bridle
wealdmoru = wêalmoru [[redirected to "wealhmoru"]] wealdnes (a) f. rule
wealdung f. - government, rule.

AnWulf Nov-28-2011

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Back outta hiding and wondering if either 'eddish' http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/eddish or 'earsh' http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earsh are good to go for 'arable' (?) and if also, how akin the aforesaid words are to: 'hurst' 'ash' and 'earth'

Anyway, gotta be something better out there to go alongside the Anglish Moot's 'plow(able)' for 'arable'

Stanmund Dec-01-2011

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Almost forgot, there's also some Middle English stuff about edible hens...

edish-henne (n.) Also ediscine. [ OE edisc-hen(n; cp. edisc pasture, park.] A quail

'a quail' ?

Stanmund Dec-01-2011

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edischenn: Game-bird

ediscweard: Pasture/pasturage

http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=rwLYx4gYfr0C&pg=PA910&lpg=PA910&dq=ediscweard&source=bl&ots=fvOByXNTnx&sig=AXcKaEjzGSXBG03rR9a3WGysFaY&hl=en&ei=3aLXTuSPHYK18QPY3Y3xDQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&redir_esc=y#v=onepage&q=ediscweard&f=false

http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/00138389708599099

/arable-hen'. Erse and edisc have different etymologies but are in complementary distribution as substantive elements in charter boundaries (Kitson, forth- .../


Old English ersc (stubble field)
http://www.jstor.org/pss/457998

Stanmund Dec-01-2011

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@stanmund ... Yu work too hard at this. Try the onefold things first:

OED: ploughland |ˈplaʊland|(US plowland )
noun [ mass noun ]
land that is ploughed for growing crops; ***arable land***.

But if yu want an OE answer:
eringland n. arable land
erian, erigean to plow
eriung f. plowing

AnWulf Dec-01-2011

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@Ængfolc - Here's one for yur skills. The forefast en- is seen in OE in the word en-līhtan = to enlighten (en-líhtan, in-líhtan, on-leóhtan, on-lýhtan). That's from the B-T Anglo-Saxon Dict) but it is an otherwise seldom seen. (Altho em- is seen a few times as well.)

I read this: Both Latin and Germanic from Proto-Indo-European *en (“in, into”). Intensive use of Old French en-, an- due to confluence with Old Frankish *an- (intensive prefix), related to Old English on- (intensive prefix).

So if Frankish had in- and the French developed en- from Frankish an- doesn't that now make en- Germanic rather than Latin?

AnWulf Dec-02-2011

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So we might use "wielding" instead of government to mean the process of governing,
maybe just "The Wield" instead of "the government" as in "The Russian Wield".
The hurdle is of course that it is not in the dictionary!

We already use "lawmakers" for the people in government, but this doesn't mean the government itself: so .....
beadle, warrantholder, beadledom, swayholder, lawwielding, mightwielder,lawbody,lawwieldingbody,lawmakingbody, swayholdingbody,
oversightbody, guides, warden, lawwarden, guidingbody.
Any other foresets??
We also need words for elections (what happened to waehlen?) and democracy (mobrule is not quite the same, and rule is latinate anyway).

jayles Dec-03-2011

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"So if Frankish had in- and the French developed en- from Frankish an- doesn't that now make en- Germanic rather than Latin?"

Yes. The Proto-Germanic, Old Latin, and Ancient Greek are all akin to one another, bound by the PIE root.

One has to look at where the word came from, and then give it a name. Here, we are talking about French getting en- from Frankish; so, here en- should be thought of as Germanic. If the French word with en- came from Latin, then we should rightly name it Latin.

In the end, en-/in- in all three tongues are siblings.

Ængelfolc Dec-03-2011

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@jayles: "what happened to waehlen?"

Wale, Waled, Waling (mainly Scottish and North English today) "something that is selected as the best; choice", "to choose; select". WALE can be used as a noun, adjective, and verb. See > Collins English Dictionary - Complete & Unabridged 10th Edition. One will still find this word in all of the best wordbooks.

1250–1300 ME wal(e) < ON val (ON velja) < PGmc *waljanan (*walan, *walō ) “desire, choice”, akin to will (vb.); Gothic waljan, O.E. willan

Ængelfolc Dec-03-2011

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Old word-string > "Will and Wale", it means having Free Choice, Freedom to Choose.

Ængelfolc Dec-03-2011

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Well we do find seldseen brooking of the en-/em- forefasts in OE ... enlīhtan (enlighten), emtwa (in two). We also have the in-/im- set. There are folks who don't want to brook en/em owing to the wordbooks all credit the forefasts to French/Latin. They ignore that the forefasts stood in OE as well.

Wale as a choice is a good find! It also means a dead body, slaughter. So I guess yu hav to take it in context. ME has walen as "to choose".

There is also kire - choice, preference, chosen, elite, custom, customary, free will, decision, selection. But I think it is only a noun.

AnWulf Dec-04-2011

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As you're talking about 'wale' I might bring up the Scots language. Here in Glasgow you sometimes hear it spoken and its vocabulary is a hoard of obsolete Old English and Middle English words. I've got a Scots - English / English - Scots dictionary which is full of modern, spoken forms of Anglo Saxon, Middle English, and Old Norse words.

Hence we get 'leid' for 'language' [Middle English 'lede', from 'leden', 'leoden' (language), from Old English 'lēoden' (national language, literally, of the people) from Old English 'lēode', (people)] which could stand in for 'dialect'

and 'thede' for 'country', 'region', 'province', 'people', or 'kind' [Middle English, from Old English 'þēod' (nation, people, tribe, race), from Proto-Germanic 'þeudō' (people, nation); akin to Modern English, 'Dutch', Modern German 'Deutsch' (German), Middle Dutch 'diet' (people), Middle High German 'diet' (people, folk, nation), Norwegian 'tjod' (people, nation), Icelandic þjóð (people, nation)] which could stand in for 'ethnicity'.

Holy Mackerel Dec-04-2011

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Yes, the Scots ... being further away from the Norman-French Overlords ... kept a lot of words. Many words are marked in the wordbooks as either obsolete or Scots!

Theod alreddy seems to be in widespread brooking. I'v seen leod tho not as much but there are no grounds (grunds?) for not also brooking leid for dialect or something ... Is it said with a long ī? ... līd?

I spent a few hours hunting down the root of "gefrain" ... meaning renown, reputation ... that is being thrown about. While it looks like "frain" ... question, it's not akin ... at least not directly. It seems to come from OE "gefræge" an adj.

Icelandic has "frægn" without the 'ge'.

AnWulf Dec-04-2011

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Gefrain I would imagine comes from 'gefrignan', 'gefrægn', 'frugnon', 'find out' from 'frignon' 'to ask'. This must be related to German 'fragen' and Dutch 'vragen', both 'to ask'. This is a very Teutonic idea of 'finding out through asking' rather than 'discovering'. This is how word spreads of fame and glory.

Holy Mackerel Dec-05-2011

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@Holy Mackerel ... That was my first thought too. However, this is a nowadays brooking or an old word. OE had other words for reputation like tōtalu. When I first saw gefrain, I thought it had something to do with an inquiry (frain = question).

Gefrain is being brooked as noun for "reputation" which seems to be from the adjectiv shape. Or forhaps it was calqued from Old Norse. There are many words that are being taken out of either OE or ON. Most are being brooked rightly or somewhat rightly. A few are just odd and this is one of them. With most words, an upspring is marked but with this one, no one seems to know where it came from so I'v been digging umbe. I first saw gefrain with the meaning of reputation, renown ... tho others only say reputation; some brook it insted of honor. No one seems to brooking in the wit of the OE noun ... knowledge information ... but rather back-shaping (back-forming) the new meaning from the old adjectiv.

gefrǽge, -frége, es; n. An inquiring, a knowing, knowledge, information, hearsay:
-- Míne gefrǽge - in my knowledge, as I have heard, as I am informed,

ge-frǽge, -frége; adj. Known, renowned, celebrated, remarkable, noted, famous, notorious, infamous: -- Hæbbe ic gefrugnen ðætte is eástdǽlum on æðelast londa, firum gefrǽge - I have heard tell that in eastern parts there is a land most noble, renowned among men.

--Ic eom folcum gefrǽge - I am known (renown, famous) among people.

--Wæs úre líf fracuþ and gefrǽge - Our life was wicked and infamous.

also gefrége: --Lǽt ðé on gemyndum hú ðæt manegum wearþ fira gefrége - Keep in thy mind how that was known among many men

Icelandic has frægn which means famous/renown.

But hey, sometimes folks brook a word wrongly and it becomes the norm.

AnWulf Dec-05-2011

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Ah I see. I imagine the noun 'gefræge' took on the sense of the adjective 'gefrǽge'. My Anglo-Saxon dictionary give 'hearsay' first for 'gefræge'. 'Renowned hearsay' is pretty good for 'reputation'.

I saw that you wrote 'adjective' also. I haven't looked up Anglo-Saxon words for grammatical terms yet (I imagine there's some mediaevel Latin primer written in Anglo-Saxon that has a few) but when I studied Icelandic I always liked the words the Icelandic Language Institute invented to keep linguistic purism. 'Lýsingorð' for 'adjective', literally 'illuminating word' from 'lýsa', 'to light up' and 'orð', word. Lightingword? I always liked 'Þolfall' for 'accusative case' which means something like 'the suffering case' or 'the case when something has to be withstood'. Good old nordic gloom. (The Icelanders also have some pretty good invented words. 'Sími', Old Norse, 'wire' for 'telephone'.) The Dutch just calls adjectives 'bijvoeglijke naamwoorden', something like 'attaching noun'. A conjunction is a 'voegswoord' which seems too similar to me.

All right, in Ælfric's 'Grammatical Terminology' a few are given. He borrows 'casus' for 'casus','part' for 'pars', and 'declinung' for 'declinatio'. He does calque 'tid' for 'tempus' (tense) and 'nama' for 'nomen' (noun), and 'dæl' for 'pars' (part of speech). I do like his 'dælnimend' for 'participium' (participle) and 'betwuxaworpenes' for 'interjectio', and 'samodswegend' for 'consonans'. I'm sure if I perused this book more I'd find some better ones.

And aye, 'leid' in Lallans is pronounced a bit like /li:d/.

Holy Mackerel Dec-05-2011

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I do like 'wordtide' for 'tense'. The Dutch word for verb is 'werkwoord' and in Frisian it's 'tiidwoord', literally ''workword' and 'timeword'. I imagine in Anglo-Saxon says the word 'verbum' was probably used.

Holy Mackerel Dec-05-2011

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I have the whole list of OE grammar terms on my old laptop. I seldseenly brook them. Most of them are fairly twisted and only calques of the Latin words.

English does have "nameword" for noun but if I had my druthers, I'd benote "nama" forthen it is shorter in length. OE had two words for pronoun, the calque "forenama" and "bīnama" (byname).

I'd hav to look but I think the OE word for verb was ... word (calquing Latin verbum ‘word'). Not very bewriting (describing).

For adjectiv it was tōgeīcendlic (added to, from tōgeīcan to add to, increase ... again, calquing the Latin). Maybe bewriter (describer) would work since an adj bewrites (describes) a noun.

AnWulf Dec-05-2011

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Found 'poll' is from M L G so we can brook it for elections

jayles Dec-06-2011

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@Holy Macker ... not wis as to what yu're looking for. I'm guessing "aspect". Here are a few more plus the ones that yu found that I expanded out.

ansîen I. (on-; ê, î, ý) fn. - countenance, face; form, figure, presence:
view, aspect, sight, thing seen; surface. [ME ansene ... anseen]

mǣgwlite (â, ê) m. aspect, appearance, species, form.

sihð, +siht (ie, y) f. - faculty or act of sight; aspect: what is seen, vision, apparition.

syge I. m. - sight, aspect, view

---

andwlita (a, eo) m. face, forehead, countenance, form (anlēt, anlete, onlete in ME)
wlita m. countenance
wlîtan to gaze, look, observe.

blêo n. gs. blêos, ds. blêo, gp. blêo(na), dip. blêom, blêo(w)um - color, appearance, form

hîw (êo, îe, ý) n. - appearance, form, species, kind; apparition [hue,color]
hîwbeorht - radiant, beautiful.

scêawung (a) f. seeing, surveying, inspection, scrutiny, examination, contemplation; respect, regard: show, spectacle, appearance; toll on exposure of goods. [showing]

wlite m. - brightness: appearance, form, aspect, look, countenance: beauty, splendor, adornment
wliteandet n. - confession of splendor
wlitebeorht - beauteous.
wliteful - beautiful
wlitelêas - ugly
wlitelîce - handsomely,lovely, beautiful.
wlîtesêon f. - sight, spectacle
wlitetorht - brilliant, lovely.
wlitewamm m. - disfigurement of the face.
wliteweorð n. - legal value of a man's life, ransom
wlitig - radiant, beautiful, fair, comely; adv. -ige, -iglîce.
wlitigfæst - of enduring beauty
wlitigian - to beautify, adorn: become beautiful, form, fashion
wlitignes f. - beauty, splendor

AnWulf Dec-07-2011

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@Jayes ... Yes, we do "go to the polls" when we choose ... lawmakers.

Odds and ends:

Here is a word that I'v been looking at this morning:
whilend - temporary (ME whilende and whilewende). I kind like the ME whilewende better, it's eather to say.

I'v been looking for word that takes the sted of "very" as an intensifier. Ferly kind of works but what I'v seen is that was usually done with a prefix either for- ... forthirst: very thirsty; forwalked: exhausted after walking ... or, in OE, fela- ... felalêof: very dear, felasynnig: very guilty.

As it so happens, the ME "fele" is still in the wordbook! It seems to be said like "feel" rather than fe-le but I'm not sure. It is said like feel in kennings like "feelefold" (also in the wordbook) - manifold, multitude (think Ger. viel) ... said like feel-fold ... also spelled felefold ... OE felafeald.

Felest means the most, the majority.

But I like fela or fe-le for very ... maybe it is only forthan the two ludes (sounds).

I thought "forthen" would be good for "because" but it turns out that "forthen" is also still in the wordbook: even, exactly, quite, already, just as, at first, further, previously.

Well, I guess I can brook "forthen" for "exactly" ... However, both forthy (said as forthī) and forwhy are still in the wordbook for "because"!

AnWulf Dec-07-2011

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Ængelfolc ... etym frain for yu. I'm befuddled from the notations. Is OE traht from OHG or Latin? Is the OHG from Latin or from the PIE?

Looks like traht and tract were in ME ... with the credit for tract (if not from traht, then at least a cognate of traht) going to Latin. After all, the pronunciation of traht and tract would be the same to me or nearly the same ... enuff to be eathly blended.

>OE
traht m. text, passage: exposition, treatise, commentary [L. tractus]

trahtbôc f. (religious) treatise, commentary

±traht-ian, -nian to treat, comment on, expound, consider. [L. tractare; Ger. trachten]

trahtian - expound, explain (from OHG trahtðn (tractare, reputare)?)
trahtung - exposition, comment ( from OHG trahtunga?)
> ME
tract(e (n.(1)) Also (early) traht.

[OE traht, tract (from L); for 15th-cent. quots. also cp. AL tractus, perh. used for L tracttus.]

AnWulf Dec-09-2011

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I've always like the word 'wlite'. We've lost all those good wl- words in English.

For 'majority', Dutch has, quite pleasingly, 'meerderheid', literally 'morehood'. German, of course, has 'Mehrheit' also.

Holy Mackerel Dec-10-2011

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In Scots, in addition to 'tae frain' we also have 'tae speir', akin to Swedish 'spörja'.

Holy Mackerel Dec-10-2011

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@AnWulf: "Is OE traht from OHG or Latin? Is the OHG from Latin or from the PIE?"

The OHG/OE tahton/trahtian is from the PIE root DERK "to see, behold, notice, observe". They are not from Latin. See pg. 499, Eur-Aryan roots, Volume 1 (1897) by Joseph Baly.

There are many overlapping PIE rooted words between Latin, Greek, and the Teutonic tongues, which "learned men" heedlessly slight and wrongfully overlook.

Ængelfolc Dec-11-2011

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@Ængelgolc ... Thanks, I wanted to be wis about it. Sometimes the marks are murky as to whether it is thought to be the root or if it is a cognate. None the less, it would be an eath thing for the "learned" folks of the time to onefoldly swap the 'h' in traht for the 'c' of tract and keep benoting the same lude but looking "smarter" by benoting the Latin one. And thus the trail of traht blends with tract. The MED has them both under one heading.

"Trail" is another one that may be wrong. Online etym says: from O.Fr. trailler "to tow," ultimately from V.L. *tragulare "to drag," from L. tragula "dragnet," probably related to trahere "to pull" (see tract (1)). Trawl: from Du. tragelen, from M.Du. traghelen "to drag," from traghel "dragnet," probably from L. tragula "dragnet."

The OED says: ORIGIN Middle English (as a verb): from Old French traillier ‘to tow,’ or Middle Low German treilen ‘haul (a boat),’ based on Latin tragula ‘dragnet,’ from trahere ‘to pull.’ Compare with trawl. ... Trawl: Middle Dutch traghelen ‘to drag’ (related to traghel ‘dragnet’), perhaps from Latin tragula ‘dragnet.’

It would seem that trail and trawl hav the same root problem as traht. The interesting thing is that traht is only benoted in the wit of comment/commentary ... nothing to do with pulling, dragging, or tracing.

@Holy Mackeral ... wlatsome is still in the wordbook.

AnWulf Dec-12-2011

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So how does one pronounce "wlatsome"??? Is the "w" silent?? and the "a" short like bat,cat.that??

jayles Dec-13-2011

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I would fain point out that "wlatsome" is forsooth "loathesome" in today's tongue.
And good yuletide to you one and all.

jayles Dec-14-2011

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@jayles ... Wlatsome \Wlat"some\, a.- Loathsome; disgusting; hateful. [Obs.]
Murder is . . . wlatsom and abhominable to God. --Chaucer.

@black jayles ... They have hav near meanings but sunder roots. Loath comewas from lāþ ... (no w). Both wlatsom and lōth were in ME ... and they both stand today.

AnWulf Dec-14-2011

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O.E. ġeōltīd

O.N. Jólnir "yule figure" (one of Odin's many names)

Miriġe Crīstesmæsse > Glæd Geol > God Geōl!!

Ængelfolc Dec-21-2011

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glæd means glad ... gesælig means happy (as does sælig)

Glæd Geol and Gesælig Niw Gear. ... Glad Yule and Gesilly(?)/(ME sely) New Year

AnWulf Dec-22-2011

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gesaelig is now of course "silly" in today's English. Perhaps we should requicken its earlier meaning?
There's nowt wrong with "happy" "merry" "blithe" - all good English words, so
"Merry Yuletide and Happy New Year!!" sounds good to me.
Or we could drink ourselves silly ....

jayles Dec-25-2011

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Well I do hav two unopened bottles of wine ...

To be a little more right ... silly comes from sælig. But we could keep the old greetings using the old forms ... just as folks often say wassail at Christmas and hav no idea of what it means! lol ... It's a smashing together of "wes hal" ... or the longer form that I brook: wes thu hal (wes þu hal).

So we could say, "Glad Yule(tide) and Gesaelig New Year!" as idiomatic.

Which is all better than wansaelig ... unhappy.

AnWulf Dec-25-2011

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Pension?? do we have a good word for it? something ending in "Gelt" perhaps?
Having spent the last six hours trying to fill in my claim for state pension... there were a lot of silly asks... like "name the exact dates on which you entered and left the UK" ... a big ask when looking back over the last forty years!!!

jayles Dec-25-2011

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Actually, to my surprise, in OE there was mēdgilda

mēd = meed - deserved share, reward
gild = compensation (guild or yield)
a = er

some who gets his deserved share of compensation ... a pensioner ... could also be a mercenary! lol

So I guess today it would be something like meedgilder, meedguilder, or meedgetter? (I don't think meedyielder works since that looks like you're yielding the meed rather than getting it.) Or if you like gelt ... geltgetter? I like either meedgilder or meedguilder.

AnWulf Dec-25-2011

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Well done!
I think 'geld' was some kind of tax. So 'pension contributions' or 'social security tax' would become 'meed-geld'.
I think 'guild' is best left with today's meaning of a club or association as in 'Guildhall'.
'Pension' itself is a return on investment and properly described as a 'yield'.
(as in 'dividend yield') so 'meed-yield' might be good for that.
To me 'meed-getter' is quite clear for pensioner.

'geld' for tax would of course mean 'taxpayers' were 'geldings' ; so apt. !!! ;=))

jayles Dec-28-2011

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I struggled to write an email in anglish at last:
I have spent much time over the yuletide break filling in writings seeking meed-geld from the English realm. It is a long-winded work because of all my time spent abroad and the end-outcome may only be about two hundred shillings a week, which is not much; but the lawmakers hereabouts will top it up to the full whack.

jayles Jan-02-2012

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@jayles:

Well done! Ausgezeichnet!

Ængelfolc Jan-02-2012

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In truth "realm" stems from "royaume" so "the English government" should perhaps be "the UK" or ???
Also I meant meed-yield not meed-geld.
It's an ongoing struggle to relearn the English tongue!
Lastly I came up with stand-ins for "inappropriate behavior" >> "untoward behavior"
"wayward behavior" "froward behavior"

jayles Jan-03-2012

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@jayles: It is a struggle for us all! I like what the words you put forth for "inappropriate". As for the "English Government", I guess it could be said that England is under the foot of the U.K. :-0

Ængelfolc Jan-04-2012

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What with the Scottish Unraveling (Scottish Devolution? < Latin, 'ex' and 'volvere', 'to roll out') you'll need to thinking again about British nomenclature. But you can still always say either England or the United Kingdom, outlandish earnings aside (Anglo-Saxon, 'utlendisc', 'foreign'). Scotland's not yet an outland. I read something in The Independent about the SNP looking to have Scotland "become a member of the Scandinavian circle of countries, with its own army, navy and air force modelled on its Nordic neighbours" after independence. Maybe we'll get a good name like 'Sjøforsvaret'. The Seaforswearing.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/bye-bye-england-snp-plans-closer-scandinavian-ties-after-independence-6272337.html

Holy Mackerel Jan-05-2012

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Scotland could be written as Skot(t)land...maybe go back to Alba...Caledonia...Scotia...

England could be Ængland again...Wales and Ireland could be > Britain!

"Sjøforsvaret" means Navy in Norwegian/Danish. A land called "Navy" > Sjø "Sea" + Forsvaret "Defence" (vb. forsvare "defend")....

Ængelfolc Jan-05-2012

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"The Home Guard" could be the English defence forces..
"horde" is an interesting word: might be "had"=army in Hungarian
Wales is rightfully called "Cymru" I think.

jayles Jan-05-2012

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Aye, 'Cymru' is the Welsh word for Wales which shares its root with 'Cumbria'. 'Wales' comes from the Anglo-Saxon 'wealh', 'foreigner' which is pretty bad. This is also the root of 'walnut', I believe.

Holy Mackerel Jan-06-2012

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Yes!

Walnut > wealh + hnutu = "foreign nut"; word came about so that this nut would not be addled with Hazelnut (O.E. hæselhnutu < P.Gmc. *hasalaz + *hnutuz)

Horde, 16c. < Mongolian or West Turkic (whence also Urdu, Hindi urdū < Persian zabān i urdū "language of the camp") to English through French, Spanish, or Czech/Polish < Ukrainian dialect gordá, Ukrainian ordá < Old Russian Zolotaya Orda < Turkic ordu, orda "royal residence or camp"; later "army". The "H" likely came from Czech/Polish.

Hungarian Had (Army) seems to be from the Finno-Ugric root *kunta; akin to Finnish kunta "community or group; corps". See also Finnish henkilökunta (staff), ihmiskunta (humankind), kansakunta (nation).

Happy New Year!

Ængelfolc Jan-06-2012

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I love the word 'addle'. The etymology given by Oxford is, Middle English : from Old English adela [liquid filth]. 'Liquid filth'. Brilliant.

It's also an archaic adjective for '(of an egg) rotten'. Now when we're confused, our minds turn to liquid egg filth.

Holy Mackerel Jan-06-2012

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geld (n.) "royal tax in medieval England"

gelt (n.) "money"

I think that meed-gelt while maybe a bit redundant would be good for the gelt gotten as the pension/reward. The earlier of foreset of using geld for tax works!

I wrote a whole blog on what military forces could be called and I need to update it with a few more ideas: http://lupussolus.typepad.com/blog/2011/08/anglo-saxon-names-for-the-modern-military.html

AnWulf Jan-06-2012

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Anwulf: you might take a look at heeresranks: eg wikipedia military comparative ranks.
Sadly the German ranks are littered with Frenchisms like Leutenant, but some such as "Feldwebel" might have come across to Engish. I know "sergeant" is N Fr but I quite like it.. and it gives us sergeant-at-arms, whereas Hauptman leads to headman or foreman which both have untoward meanings in today's English.

jayles Jan-06-2012

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AnWulf:

I think you will like this book > http://books.google.com/books?id=RONb2alF0rEC&pg=PA203&dq=Gothic+military+language&hl=en&sa=X&ei=jywJT-n_Ec_TgQfp17GcAg&ved=0CDQQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Gothic%20military%20language&f=false

The writer seems to say that Latin loans (Church words notwithstanding) began to come into the Germanic tongues (here Gothic) in about 257 A.D., when he Romans gave Dacia to the Goths. Here is where a lot of war words from Latin came from. It seems that when the Goths were fighting for Rome, they brooked the Roman words. When fighting for the Gothic Heere, they brooked Germanic words.

Let me know what you think...

Ængelfolc Jan-07-2012

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So "the draft" (as in conscripted soldiers) is Germanic?
But cook, bake, oil, cheese, are at root more Latinate?
It seems to me that the thrust of "Anglish" should be more about shunning snobbish overdressed, unneeded words than overworrying about their true historic roots.

jayles Jan-08-2012

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Yes DRAFT (Draught) is from O.E. *dreaht, *dræht "to drag/draw" < PGmc. *dragan "to pull, draw"

"It seems to me that the thrust of "Anglish" should be more about shunning snobbish overdressed, unneeded words than overworrying about their true historic roots."

They go hand in hand!

BAKE is not from Latin: It's Germanic. BAKE < Old English bacan “to bake” < PGmc *bakanan "to bake" < P.I.E. *bheg-/bhag-

Ængelfolc Jan-08-2012

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I thought "baker" orignally came from the latin "pistor" ????

jayles Jan-09-2012

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@Ængelfolc ... It's only natural that soldiers will take words from whichever military they're serving ... or in a lot of contact with. If I were in the French Foreign Legion, I'd kno a lot of French military terms ... But then, many of the English speaking military terms are French to begin with! In our case, the Saxon athelu (nobility) was hunted down and slaughtered in the years after 1066 so the Norman-French military terms took over.

@Jayes
bake
O.E. bacan "to bake," from P.Gmc. *bakanan (cf. O.N. baka, M.Du. backen, O.H.G. bahhan, Ger. backen), from P.Gmc. *bakan "to bake," from PIE *bheg- "to warm, roast, bake"

Cook is fore-1066 (as is oil which is Greek rooted)
cook (n.)
O.E. coc, from V.L. cocus "cook," from L. coquus, from coquere "to cook, prepare food, ripen, digest, turn over in the mind" from PIE base *pekw- "to cook" (cf. Oscan popina "kitchen," Skt. pakvah "cooked," Gk. peptein, Lith. kepti "to bake, roast," O.C.S. pecenu "roasted," Welsh poeth "cooked, baked, hot"). Germanic languages had no one native term for all types of cooking, and borrowed the Latin word (cf. O.S. kok, O.H.G. choh, Ger. Koch, Swed. kock).

A word that I found still in a wordbook ... hersum ... obey (v), obedient (adj) ... hersumness (obedience). That's pretty much unchanged from OE except that the verb was hersumian.

And if you don't want to call that little blinking light on your modem (or other electronic stuff) a "status light" or "indicator light" ... calling a blinkenlight! Yes, that is a word for them!

And if you don't want to say multiply, multiplying, multiplication ... Say times and timesing (in the OED!) Yu should hav seen that flak that I caught on another forum for telling someone that they are good words! Even after I quoted timesing in several books going back many, many years (late 1800s) ... they still insisted that either it's not a word or that it shouldn't be brooked formally! (They don't like brook for use either! lol)

AnWulf Jan-09-2012

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It. Pistore, Portuguese Pistor < L. Pistor "miller, baker" < L.L. Pistare, freq. of L. pī(n)sere (pp. pistus) "stamp, pound, crush"; see also L. Pistrix "miller, baker". Akin to pist(e), pestle/ pistil (from the same PIE root), piston, and pesto.

L. Pistor has nothing to do with the root of English/Germanic BAKE.

Ængelfolc Jan-10-2012

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HERSUM is also an adjective in Scottish English. It means "rancid, rank, harsh"; akin to Danish harks "rank, rancid".

Ængelfolc Jan-12-2012

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The words 'hearsome' and 'hearsomeness' can still be found in the wordbook.

Holy Mackerel Jan-15-2012

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@HolyMackerel ... Good catch. Yes, they are and can be found in brooking after ME. I like hersum better owing to its a little shorter; it retains the better spelling of "sum" rather than "some"; and the meaning is less likely to befuddled. Only to look at the word, one would think more related to hearing than "hear and obey". To me, without knowing the true meaning, a "hearsome woman" would be one that likes to eavesdrop!

OTOH, it might be eather, to get folks to brook hearsome than hersum ...

AnWulf Jan-16-2012

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HERSUM < Old English hīersum, ġehīersum, Low German horzam, hursam = German gehorsam, all have the same root > hoeren "to listen", Eng. hearken/harken, German horchen, Old Frisina harkia "listen", and others.

Ængelfolc Jan-16-2012

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Oh....and, how could I forget....HEAR! LOL!

Ængelfolc Jan-16-2012

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An interesting word: min
adj - less, small (OE min) See it in ME min(t)while ... an instant, moment
noun - memory, remembrance (ON minni)
verb - to remind, remember, mention (ON minna)

AnWulf Jan-19-2012

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In German, we still say minnen (to love < tongue in cheek) and die Minne, der Minnesaenger/ Minnesang, and das Minnetrinken. All of these are akin to M.E. min < ON minni. The word that stemmed from the same root (*[ga]minþijan) in today's English is MIND, Minion, and Minikin (from Dutch).

M.E. min < O.E. min < PGmc. *minniz, shares the same Germanic root as German minder "less, lower", and the same PIE root as L. minus.

Ængelfolc Jan-19-2012

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This reMINDS me of something. I seem to remember from Icelandic class the word 'mynd', 'picture'. I always thought it had something to do with the English word 'mind'. They've got 'hugmynd' for 'idea', literally, 'mind-picture'. I think 'mynd' still retains the meaning 'imagination' in Faroese. I know Old English had 'gemynd' [memory, thought]. Maybe it's related to 'minna'. Anyone have an Faroese or Icelandic etymological dictionary handy?

Holy Mackerel Jan-22-2012

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The other day I wrote "mindsight" for imagination without even thinking about. But I guess it would work for idea as well.

AnWulf Jan-22-2012

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"I always thought it [mynd] had something to do with the English word 'mind'."

It has the same roots as written about MIND above. Old Icelandic mynd, Gothic gamund(s), OHG gemunt, OE gemynd < PGmc *gamundiz, *mundiz “memory, remembrance” < PIE *men- "think".

Also, in today's German we have German meinen and mahnen from the same roots; Faroese ljósmynd "photograph". Icelandic Vennmynd "Venn Diagram", Icelandic kvikmynd "motion picture".

Who says that Teutonic tongues need Latin and Greek to make them "richer"?

Ængelfolc Jan-22-2012

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I s'pose the bridge is the meaning of 'imagination'. Our English word 'mind' has lost this sense of imagery and pictures--'the mind's eye', as it were. 'Kvikmynd' is great, though. We have very few general words for illustrations, pictures, images, et c. with English roots.

Holy Mackerel Jan-23-2012

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This Anglish idea is outstanding, and I enjoy reading about it. I hope someone is keeping track of the word-treasury that is being made here.

Waes ge hael!

Ceolfrid Jan-23-2012

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Today I tripped across this word: tholemod* - meaning patient. I'v also found it brooked as a noun as "patience" but I hav also seen tholemodness benoted for the noun as well. I haven't found either brooked beyond ME (for ease of reading: þ,ð = th, ᵹ = g):

For tholemod is, the thuldeliche abereth woh thet me him deth. Eadmod is, the tholie mei thet me him mis-segge. ... For patient is, who patiently bears woe that one him does. Humble is, who tolerates mess that folks (to/of) him mis-say.

It's a kenning of thole+mood ... a tolerating-mood > patience.

Here's another one:
Her biginneth the other dale of the heorte warde thurh the fif wittes. ... Here begins the twoth** part of the heart-ward thru the five senses.

I like dale for part (a sunder spelling for deal). Mark that witt is sense.

One more:
... god is thet ye easki read ant salve thet he teache ow togeines fondunges. ... good is that you aseek (ask) rede and salve (remedies) that he teaches you against temptation. Fondunge (OE fandung) is temptation.

tholemod: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/tholemod
twoth: http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/twoth

On another note, I was saddened to find that "gist" and "mess" hav Latin roots. Since it means "essence", I was guessing that gist had come thru the Franks and was akin to geist ... but I was wrong. :( ... Still, I like the word! lol

Anent mess, I should hav guess that it was French since it is brooked in the military in "mess hall".

AnWulf Jan-24-2012

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Great English Word


>> YARK "To dispose; be set in order for; be destined or intended for"

Ængelfolc Jan-25-2012

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bin der selber Meinung. I had a trimaran that was quite yare, although I was unyarked to go out in really bad weather.
Reasons: the whys and wherefores... or just the wherefore
the means: the wherewithal
Prime MInister->> the High-Reeve ????
Chancellor ->> Chief Steward ??? ("doorkeeper" sounds a bit low)

jayles Jan-28-2012

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