First Generation vs. Second Generation

generation??? i dunno...
because that's my assignment...
hehehehe... Smile!!!!

Hey Tae Hee,

Whether or not you believe it, that is what we say in my family. Chill out.

Guys, Porches clarified the whole problem about one and a half years ago...
Anyway, let's say my father and my half sister -from my mom's side- both born in France, have a little girl over there and then move to the US. 15 years later my half brother -from my dad's side, of a previous marriage which wasn't with my mom- falls in love with my half sister kills our dad and have a baby with her. They then move to Puerto Rico to conceive their second baby to then move to Dominican Republic where my Half sister -who's a bit of a slut- gives birth to their hermaphrodite child. In the mean time my mom has gone out of jail and goes meet her daughter and grand children to fall in love with my half brother. They kill my half sister under the influence of mushroom and conceive a baby in a plan while flying over the us and crash in Canada. The fetus manages to stick into a humidified piece of fabric from my mom's seat and somehow end up in a river and gets eaten by a water snake
that will somehow give birth to my little brother/nephew in the French speaking part of Guyana... now is this baby First generation French? third generation African -never know-? Second generation American? Puerto Rican -no need of generation with Puerto Rican anyway they all more or less live here-? Third generation Dominican? A fucking bastard? 1st/ second generation Snakelander?

I always considered myself first generation American, as I was born in the US and both my parents were immigrants. My father eventually naturalized, my mother did not.

I noticed that a number of the immigrants claiming to be first generation Americans mentioned that their parents brought them to this country as children. What do they call their parents? They didn't say.

Adding to the confusion of course is the fact that my parents came from the Caribbean. People in Central and South America consider themselves Americans too. They call residents of the US North Americans or Yankees. Frank Lloyd Wright coined the term Usonian. It hasn't caught on yet.

I finally hear something that sounds more logical than what any of the others have mentioned. I agree with what Nick (11/12/06) says...and this is how I am gathering thise:

My mother was born in Mexico and of all her 11 siblings were too. My mother was the first to have a child that was born in California (that would be me), so I am a 1st generation American.

I also was the first to have a child in California for my generation (my son SO), so he would then be the first of the 2nd generation American.

My cousin (of my generation) had a daughter (who would be of the 2nd generation) recently had a child here in California. Her child is now the first born of the 3rd generation...?

Wheh...WOW!!!

The Greek word 'genea' means birth. But the applicable Webster's definition of the English word 'generation' is "a body of living beings constituting a single step in the line of descent from an ancestor". So, the word meerly distinguishs my grandparents, my parents and myself as unique links in the chain of geanology.

The question is, what action is "first" qualifying (to be born, to imigrate, to acquire citizenship). I think that it is the first generation "to permantly reside" in the US. When we talk about generations, birth and citizenship are secondary. We are more interested in the level of assimilation into the local culture, language, and community. The immigrant generation deserves credit for being "the first" to struggle with assimilating and socializing into the new country. They are the FIRST GENERATION!!!

No one has discussed who is first generation if both parent and child immigrate at the same time.

Could they both be first generation?

Would the child still be second generation?

Or are the child's children the first generation?

(this is if the parent and child are both citizens)

No one has discussed who is first generation if both parent and child immigrate at the same time.

Could they both be first generation?

Would the child still be second generation?

Or are the child's children the first generation?

(this is if the parent and child are both citizens)

My name is Gebissa I was born in Ethiopia, live and work in Germany I have two children in US born right now they live in germany too we are planning to move in state but we don`t have a permant resedent how could we get that on behalf of our child?

I have the same question "John" asked previously. If only one of my parents were born outside the US, immigrated here and married a US citizen..what generation does that make me?

Wow, I can't believe this post is still active after more than a year, especially when the term is officially ambiguous. Here's another interesting ambiguity. Let's say it's Wednesday and I say we're going to do something next week. It's pretty clear that I mean sometime on or after the coming Sunday (or Monday, depending on your point of view). "This week" is the week we are in, "next week" is the following week. Now, what if I say "next WEEKEND"? Some people will interpret it to mean this coming weekend, and others will interpret it to mean the weekend after this coming weekend. I think the ambiguity stems from the fact that Wednesday isn't part of a weekend. Ifr you aren't in a current time period then it's unclear what is meant by the "next" time period. This coming weekend really isn't "this weekend" unless you are actually IN the weekend already (or is it?:)

I just read the other billion definitions and I realize that I must be blind for not noticing them before. Gosh, I'm confused all over again, and I think the only solution for me is merely to use my preference.

I meant the Webster dictionary definition. I just read your entry, Elizabeth.

Someone mentioned something interesting. He said that he was a Japanese American (without the hyphen). Does it mean something different with the hyphen?

What I mean to say is, is being an African-American different from being an African American?

I know the term is ambiguous now. I can rest.

Everyone, it's only a matter of preference. There is no use arguing. Before you reply to this read the dictionary definition above!

My friend was born in another country and immigrated to the U.S. when he was only a year old. If he were to have children, I could say that his children were first or second generation. I would just choose whichever sounds cooler.

What I'm trying to say is that it doesn't matter. We could be technical about it, but if we keep providing our evidence on why we think it should be this way, we'll never finish this discussion.

English is a pain....

I forgot to add, all of the dictionary definitions I have seen refer to "first generation" as "first generation U.S. citizen.

The word generation comes from the Greek word genea which means birth.

Therefore, the first generation is the one that is born in the country.

My gransparents were born in Greece, my parents are first generation Americans. I am a second generation American.

If I move to Italy and have a chile there it will be first generation Italian. I will still be second generation American and an immigrant in italy.

I can't believe this is topic was going on for more then a year. It doesn't matter if you have green card or citizen or not, but if you, as who was born in US, wouln't be here if you weren't for your parents. The way I see it is simple then what it is. I was adpoted by American family. If i were to have kids, they WILL BE 2ND GEN. I'm the 1st Gen in America. I can't belieive comment by AO back in Apr-16-06 that AO would be the first generation in he/she family because he/she was to born in America for the first time and saying "to have an American head." So question is where his/her parents comes in place?? As you some people mentioned "zero generation" There is no such this as zero Generation.

My mother asked me this question, wanting to know if she's 3rd or 4th generation. I asked some of the members of our genealogy society, and no one was sure. After reading all of this, I'm still not sure! I am, however, incllined towards 'the first generation born here' simply because so many immigrants were families: parents and children - which otherwise would mean that both the parents and those children would be '1st generation', while any children born subsequently would be '2nd generation' - which would split siblings.

All of my 2nd great-grandparents were immigrants; but in several cases (on my father's side), they came with their parents (my 3rd gg parents). What does that make me?

I think it would be clearest to refer to:
the 'immigrant generation(s)' and
the 'first American-born generation' etc.

Just to help those of you out who are filling out surveys and applications:

All language is inherently ambiguous, and is only good insofar as an idea from one person can be communicated to another. In other words, if I have my own language, but never use it to communicate with other people, the words don't have a "meaning," though they may have a definition.

I should be clear that this only applies to those who want to fill out surveys and applications, and not the broader dispute about "meaning" in general conversation; those of you seeking to determine meaning on a survey or application have a much narrower task: how do I, without being misleading, inform my prospective employer, or surveyor, of my status? If the survey/application asks you what generation you are, then they presumably have some definition of "first-generation" in mind; they certainly aren't using the terms as "generally accepted," as I think the bulk of this thread has demonstrated, such a meaning does not exist.

In the end, there's only one way to inform the surveyor of your status: either choose a generation, and explain in a "comments" section, or ask the person or persons responsible for the survey how they define the terms. Otherwise, you may mean to say one thing, and communicate something entirely different.

so i'm pretty sure that first-generation americans /first-generation citizens are people whose parents were born in another country and they are the first person in their family to be born as a citizen of the country (i.e. of the United States). then first-generation immigrants would be the parents in this case, who are the first people to move to the new country (they live in the country now, but they were born elsewhere). for example, my parents are first-generation immigrants who were born in Kurdistan, and immigrated to the United States (and became naturalized citizens). i was born in the United States and thus i am a first-generation American.

LoLo - if you scroll to the top and read to the bottom, you will know how to answer your question. If you want it summed up then here it is...

According to both Webster's dictionary and most of the opinions posted, It seems that you may label yourself either "First Generation" or "Second Generation" if you choose to do so. This means that your parents can label themselves "First Generation" or "First Generation Immigrants" or "Immigrants".

Before doing a search on these Labels and terms like you have, I always thought the I was an immigrant and that my children will be "First Generation". But, reading this blob has enlightened me to the various "correct" interpretations of these Labels and whether one should depend of these Labels at all. So I believe the proper thing to tell your classmates would be to say that you are both "First Generation" and "Second Generation" depending on who's asking.

Ok...not the answer I was looking for..but heres some more information. My parents are the first one from my family to move to the US in 1983. I was then born in 1985. Now, that would make me what generation? :) Someone help me here. Thanks!!

postscript: it just occurs to me: why should the numbering of your generation depend upon who you happen to be in the company of when you arrive? If you arrive in the U.S. as a sixteen-year-old with your grandparents and your parents, and if the grandparents get naturalized (or not, depending upon definitions above) are you then considered "third generation"? Seems kind of funny to me. Back to how definitions evolve: what were they trying to determine/measure back when they created the distinction? How did the options or answers change over time? Thankfully we are all free to interpret and question this, and definitions can morph (as I believe Websters did by adding definition #2 over time).

I like bismarck's comments...I think the confusion comes because I bet if you check old English terms, the question was: how long has your family been upon this land? And for the first 100 years or so it was a question Americans asked one another re: how far they were removed from the "mother country" and it had to do explicitly with BIRTH. After all, why make the distinction? Well, if you are born here, this is probably all you know, especially in a world without airplanes, etc., and that described a different individual than a.) those left behind; and b.) those who came here mid-life (pioneers/pilgrims). First generation described someone who didn't have a choice: they were born here because of decisions their parents made.
Later, when much more immigration occurred from other countries after there was a requirement to be "naturalized" or otherwise accepted, it makes sense that they would have different standards for defining the terms...

Hi. Everyone. I am actually confused about this subject. My parents immigrated here from Vietnam, and I was the first one to be born in the US. SO, I get confused when my teacher asks me am I first or second generation. Can somebody help me with that! I want to be able to answer that question in class! Thanks!!

i am an immigration attorney and third-generation japanese american (i.e. grandparents immigrated, parents born here) and i find that many immigrants use the terms interchangeably and could care less about this distinction. for example, i have greek friends who loathe being called anything but "greeks living in the usa" despite having been born here in the usa and having never lived in greece. in contrast, i have other friends who bristle at being labled anything other than "american" and do not want that status qualified in any manner whatsoever.

in melting pots like new york, l.a., etc., the question, "what are you?" often begets a declaration of ethnicity followed by an explanation of one's family immigration history. so, my conclusion is that both are correct and it really comes down to a matter of preference.

*note that i did not use a hypen between japanese and american (another "issue" among ethnic groups in america)

bizmark, I don't think we are imposing biological conventions on social issues. I think we are imposing biological conventions on biological issues. Namely, BIRTH.

i took asian american studies classes when i was in college and i was taught that i am a first generation filipino-american. my parents were born in the philippines, but immigrated here almost 40 years ago. They were just recently naturalized. I refer to them as filipinos (not filipino-americans), but when i want to be more specific i say they are naturalized americans (implying they were born elsewhere). Question: What if a canadian born citizen visits the US and has a child here? The child is definitely american but the mother is not. The mother's citizenship, if she chooses to apply for it, is dependent on the BIRTH of the child.

Why are people so emphatic about knowing the truth when it is clearly ambiguous as this discussion proves?

This question has already been answered categorically and incontrovertibly nearly 8 months ago. I am amazed that it is still generating such discussion and dissent!

My parents were born in Turkey and immigrated to the USA in 1911. They are not first generation. My two brothers and I are since we were born in the States.

Would like to know if any of you have had problems as first generation Americans if you're parents only knew the "old country" way.

"You cannot live in this country unless you are a naturalized citizen. I would say 99% of the immigrants who had children here were naturalized Americans."

I agree with Dyske that the term '1st generation' is ambiguous. However, the statement above is decidedly incorrect. Moot point or no, it shouldn't have been used to support any argument.

Some clarity is derived when you notice who's using the term. People still in the homeland tend to consider emigrants as the 1st generation.

American citizens already here prior to immigrants' arrival wouldn't have cared to refer to them as anything approaching a '1st generation'.

The children of immigrants would tend to be motivated to consider their parents as part of the American tapestry.

Both groups might be expected to loathe doing anything that might be interpreted as diluting their hard-fought identity as Americans.

The definition also varies upon field...in psychology, "first generation " implies the generation that immigrated to the U.S. and "second generation" refers to being born in the U.S. to parents who immigrated/emigrated from elsewhere. I've also heard the term 1.5 generation as CQ described above. The term is ambiguous, I'm sure you'd find that even if you asked those holding doctoral degrees.

Les-

Here's a way to figure out what the survey probably means. Do they have a separate "immigrant" choice (in addition to a "first generation" option? If so, they probably mean "child of immigrants" by "first generation"; if not, they probably mean "immigrant."

Unless there's some reason to belive they expect only native-born Americans to be filling out the poll.

From the Oxford English Dictionary (with history of the term):

b. first- (or second-, etc.) generation a., designating a member of the first (or second, etc.) generation of a family, spec. of descendants of immigrant parents, esp. in the United States; also, designating a naturalized immigrant (or a child, etc., of a naturalized immigrant). Also transf. and fig.

1896 S. A. BARNETT Let. Sept. in H. Barnett Canon Barnett (1918) II. 119 There are the usual Americans. One ‘first-generation man’, as he calls himself..has made a great fortune. 1946 J. O'HARA in 55 Short Stories from New Yorker (1952) 199 Francis had his place at the bar, at the far corner, and it was his so long as he was present. First-generation Jimmy and second-generation Jimmy had seen to that. 1951 M. MCLUHAN Mech. Bride 67/1 First-generation immigrants who quickly made good. Ibid. 67/2 The father is just such a second-generation type. 1953 E. COXHEAD Midlanders vi. 153 Herself a second-generation college girl, she now under-valued the freedoms the pioneers had won. 1956 Nature 10 Mar. 489/2 Second-generation inbreds... Fourth-generation inbreds... F1 hybrids between third-generation inbreds. 1960 Guardian 29 July 4/4 Deriabin, born in 1921, was a second generation Communist. 1960 Ibid. 5 Nov. 3/6 A second-generation Kenyan whose father was one of the pioneer settlers in the White Highlands. 1962 Chem. Engin. Progress Oct. 44 (caption) First generation (left) and improved (right) void-free laminates of phenolic resin and graphite fabric. 1968 L. BLACK Outbreak ix. 86 The number of notifications [of smallpox] will rise sharply, as second and third generation cases emerge from the incubation period.

Wow. I searched the internet for a definition of nth generation because a survey question asked me what generation I was. As I have read, the definition can apply to both foreign-born and native-born. This doesn't help me at all......

A first-generation immigrant is either someone born in America whose parents immigrated, or a person who immigrated but attained U.S. citizenship.

Dyske is completely wrong when he states that "The majority of Green Card holders have no intension of becoming citizens because they prefer to be the citizens of their origins. They just want to work here."
This is simply not true; many immigrants permanently move to the U.S., but do not wish to become citizens. They work here, but did not just come here to work. Most do have families, and their children are U.S. citizens. It is not at all a rare occurence, but actually quite frequent, especially in cities and suburbs. There is absolutely nothing wrong with living here on a green card and having a family; if a person feels no need to become a U.S. citizen then they will not.
p.s. People who cannot even spell words correctly in English should not pretend to know exact stats about the immigrant population in the U.S. (ahem...Dyske)

Molly, check out dyske's posting below. According to the dictionary, both your grandfather and great-grandfather could be considered 1st generation. The expression is ambiguous.
Now, let's have some fun. Was the expression always ambiguous? If not, what was the original definition?:)

i would like to clarify something from anonymous's post on january 2, about "hapa" referring to half japanese american. "hapa" means "half" in hawaiian, and in hawaii this word is often used in the context of "hapa haole" meaning "half foreigner/stranger" or "half white." historically, white people in hawaii were considered foreigners, while asians have been more integrated into hawaii's society. today in hawaii, hapa usually refers to someone half asian and half white, but i have heard the term used throughout much of the united states as a label celebrating all sorts of bi/multi-racial and bi/multi-ethnic makeups.