Submitted by gargeug on December 8, 2005

Charade you are!!

I have heard the expression “Ha Ha, charade you are” in the pink floyd song pigs, and also in a southpark episode. In the episode cartman used it like you would use the phrase “touchee” in an argument. Does anyone have any input as to what this phrase means and an example of using it.

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Touchee(Spelt Touché) Is french for "Touch", though most people use it in english when someone counters your argument, or comes up with something better than what you said.

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Pink Floyd is a British band (those surviving members anyway) so it's possible that 'charade you are' is cockney rhyming slang. The answer may well be found in a Brit/US Eng slang online dictionary. Confusingly, much slang from the 2 countries is different, and often the same word will have 2 totally different meanings in each country.
Touché does come from the French, and the term more specifically comes from the sport of Fenching when one competitor's strike is countered or bettered by his/her opponent's hit.
Churba is correct in his explanation, the above is just more background info.

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Churba may be correct as for as is goes, but it doesn't answer gargeug's question. Gareug already knows what "touche" means.

I believe "Ha Ha, charade you are" doesn't mean "touche" per se, but actually means something like "you big phoney, I'm onto you".
I think the Pink Floyd song is the origin of the expression. The song is an indictment of greedy, powerseeking people. The lyric, "Ha Ha, charade you are" seems to be just a poetic version of "you are a charade", a phoney, a pretender, a travesty, etc.

for some interesting and useful discussions see:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-revie...

or

http://msgboard.snopes.com/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.c...

And just for the record, in fencing, "touche" simply means to score a point by touching one's opponent with one's foil. Fencing does have some peculiar rules about defending from an attack before launching a counter-attack (reposte), hence the metaphor.

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isnt charade a word game where you change the syllables?
ex: at-mo-sphere-> sphere-mo-at

the young french people like to do that and therefore it became a kind of language called: VERLAN (from french "l'envers"- "spelled backwards")

verlan ex: naportnaouak = n'importe quoi - whatever
caillera = racaille - someone who is interrupting others in a bad way

so the word "charade" with "touché" may refers to verlan...

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Charades is a game where one person tries to act out a phrase and the others guess. And the best definition online I could find was:
charade. noun {C}. an act or event which is clearly false:. - Everyone knew who
was going to get the job from the start - the interviews were just a charade.

Going by the song lyrics, it seems to mean simply "you are a charade" -- a phoney, a lie, a joke, etc.
But my first thought was that it simply comes from the sarcastic "Ha! Sure you are!" I haven't seen the Southpark episode so I don't know

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I don't know which South Park episode you are referring to, but I suspect that he actually said, "Ha Ha! So right you are!" As a native English speaker, "Charade you are" is not an idiom I am familiar with.

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Porsche is correct. "Charade you are!" means a dupe has been uncovered/exposed; as in,
"HA! You big fake!" or "I caught you" I'm sure Sherlock would say it.

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South Park no doubt makes fun of the Pink Floyd line when they use it with Cartman.

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Madeline, it's not cockney rhyming slang.

Mobes hit the nail on the head with his/her definition. Putting 'charade' at the beginning of the phrase emphasises the sarcasm intended for the recipient.

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"isnt charade a word game where you change the syllables?
ex: at-mo-sphere-> sphere-mo-at"

I believe you are thinking of constructing anagrams, where you re-arrange a word to form other words using the exact same letters... there is a game using anagrams, where you re-arrange the letters of a noun to form new words or a sentence that describes that noun...sounds like loads of fun to me lol....

Charades is an 'acting' game where you visually act out a word, phrase, action etc (but you cant talk) while your partner guesses what you are trying to portray.

Anyways...the discussion on what "charade you are" means has already been answered for the most part....the writer of the song (in this case, Roger Waters,) is laughing at a "pig", which is (among other things) the industrial bourgeoisie of England, getting rich off the sweat and tears of the proletariat (working class people), and accsuing them of being nothing more than a charade (literally defined as: a parody; a composition that imitates somebody's style in a humorous way...but in this case we bend it a bit to mean someone who is not what they seem and making fun of them for it).

The entire album Animals is a direct attack against society and certain specific individuals, making it one of the more meaningful Floyd albums.

To sum up, Roger Waters sees the big man, the "pig man", as a ''charade'', saying he is "...nearly a laugh, But you're really a cry". So one can interpret this as Roger Water's belief that the 'Animals' -the rich industrialists, the people controlling- are not the powererful men that they may see themselves as...but instead, they are a laugh (ha! ha!)...a charade of a REAL man...the working people.

We see a transition in the album of Pigs to Dog to Sheep (as the album was largely infulenced by George Orwell's novel Animal Farm), as Rogers explores society and balks at the present state of rich controlling the poor.

This is not a complete synopsis of the album by any means, but you get the idea...


"You know that I care what happens to you,
And I know that you care for me.
So I don't feel alone,
Or the weight of the stone,
Now that I've found somewhere safe
To bury my bone.
And any fool knows a dog needs a home,
A shelter from pigs on the wing."

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Don't forget the bus stop rat bag (Maggie Thatcher, according to some) and Mary Whitehouse, who also receive the "ha ha, charade you are."

In the 3rd verse there's this cool yet enigmatic line: "You house proud town mouse." The whole verse is about Mary Whitehouse (British pro-censorship advocate of the day), but doesn't the White House in DC also house a proud town mouse? And how in the world does that line apply to Mary Whitehouse? Unless the word "house" is used as a verb, the line is just a collection of words. If "house" and "proud" were hyphenated, he could be calling her a town mouse who's proud of her house, but there's no hyphen. Does she herself house some kind of metaphoric town mouse?

Any takers?

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"Charade you are" means ""you are wrong"
for example: person one says: dinosaurs were giant origamis!" and the other person would say "HA! charade you are! they were real animals!"

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i've gotta go with Mr.TroPiCal on this one..
his explanation has it all.

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HA HA CHARADE YOU ALL ARE!

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Fo' SEAX!

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Ive been getting really into south park lately and ive noticed that Cartman actually says it in more than one episode, perhaps even three or four..

for example the scott tenorman episode "Charade you are Scott!"

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"Charade you are" meaning "fake you are" seems to be the best definition. Maybe also "tricky you are." But if Waters had actually pronounced it 'sha-raid' instead of 'sha-rod' (which may be the English way). I don't think this would be a discussion.

When I first heard Cartman say it on South Park, I thought it was "So right you are." It was my friend, who watches South Park regularly and listens to Animals (maybe more) regularly, who pointed out the connection.

I don't think South Park was making fun of Pink Floyd.

The episode in particular (Scott Tenorman Must Die) uses several references to pigs.
Scott gets Cartman to sing "I'm a lil' pig, oink oink oink, here is my tail and here is my snout" (or something similar) to the tune of "I'm a Little Teapot".
Also at the end Cartman says "That's All Folks" mimicing Porky Pig.
And as I'm sure we all know "Ha Ha Charade you are" is from the song "Pigs"

Radiohead, aband influenced by the Floyd, was featured on the show as well.

Of course, none of this means that those pointy-pokey-jokey guys from South Park weren't making fun of Pink Floyd. I just don't think they were.

The Wikipedia article on "Scott Tenorman Must Die" has some insights, which I mostly put here.

Sincerely,
Revvin' Levin

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I just want to point out that Cartman actually uses "Charade you are!" in several episodes. He says it to Skler after he takes a picture of him making out with Stans sister, Cartman took a picture of them to use as blackmail. He also says it to Miss Chokesondik right before he believes they are about to travel back in time to the third grade.

Cartman's use of the term is clearly " Ha Ha Ha, I've one uped you!" Or "I've gotten the better of you" which is fitting for Cartman's character

Pink Floyds meaning is less clear to me, I always felt they were using as a term for "your a fraud and I'm exposing you..."

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I was searching for the origin of this phrase, as I have also heard it on South Park a few times, and even on the Family Guy, Stewie has said it at least once. I had recognized it from the Pink Floyd song "Pigs (Three Different Ones)", but I wasn't sure if it originated there or if Roger Waters had borrowed it from another source. In my quick seaerch, I also found the rest of the lyrics to the song, and it definately made more sense...carry on...

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"a charade you are"
a pretence you are; a phony/fake you are.

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im not convinced that any of you guys has a handle on this thing.

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I'm not convinced you "have" a handle on english either.

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i am a 14 year old floyd nerd
and i agree with Mobes
isnt it self explanitory?

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"Any" can mean a singular. Has is appropriate, if not common.

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Uh, no, tork3:
"Is any one of you coming to my party?" - singular.
"Are any of you coming to my party?" - plural.

The "...of you guys..." forces "any" to be understood only as plural. If it were "...any one of you guys..." or something similar, then it could be singular.

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hey, isnt it kind of obvious if you actually listen to the song that it means "you are a fake" in that context. It's like "you are a charade". I dont know what it would mean in other contexts, but doesn't that make sense?

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Kind of like the "environmental" crowd! They claim to care about the environment and all but their real agenda is to USE the environmental movement to cripple capitalist economies and institute socialism!

HA HA! CHARADE YOU ARE!!!!

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Charade you are = Fake you are.
You are fake.
=
Just like some previous msgs stated.
-
Compare Pink Floyds "Animals" with "Animal Farm" The book we all read in Elementary school about religion and goverment.

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duh

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madeline and otheres are right about the phrase charade you are. You are fake, you are a phony. Think of the word charade like you know it in the US. The the game charades. They just pronounce the word different, and use it differently, but its the same origin. charade: parody: a composition that imitates somebody's style in a humorous way.

charade you are = your putting on a facade
charade you are = you would eat your own shit if it would make people think you were cool
charade you are = think and live for yourself, your too cought up in your fake life and what other people think of you

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"Ha ha charade you are" is simple if you tihnk about it. The game charades is when you are acting so it really just means your only acting.

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"Charade you are" is clearly taken from the Pink Floyd song Pigs (Three Different Kinds), and Cartman does indeed use it in several other episodes.

He *might* be lambasting his victim (Miss Choksondik, Scott Tenorman, etc.) as a phoney or a travesty, but the term is not used in the way described by "notmyrealemail", which is pure nonsense.

But he might just be quoting a tag line from his favourite song (which will no doubt go waaay over his head 'cos he's only eight & probably wouldn't be able to find Britain on a map, let alone be expected to know anything about Mary Whitehouse).

Just to correct Lev Nasalbomb's British pronunciation - charade" is pronounced "sha-rahd" in Britain (not sha-raid, as in the US).

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Antiseptic, since you are in a correcting mood, I just thought I'd point out that Lev Nasalbomb DID say that the British pronunciation is "sha-rahd", so you were incorrect in correcting her.

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I would like to begin by saying that most of you are d-bags for just regurgitating the stuff you read on wikipedia and what you learned in tenth grade economics class then adding big fancy words to your mindless posts. That being said, the only logical way to look at this is by looking at the phrase in context with the meaning of the song. The song is indeed refering to people in power who suck ass and are fakes. After extensive research and contemplation (about three seconds) you can tell that "charade you are" means "you're a fake" or phony or whatever you want. (This would be a great time to add in some fancy word from the thesaurus) A final thought: Poop jokes are funny.

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Antiseptic, I'd also like to point out that you are wrong about Cartman not knowing alot, being as he is eight. He did lead an amry through South Park (several times), tricked his parents into being killed and fed them to their child, among other things. I do believe he would know what that means, and be able to find Britain on a map.

Ha ha, Charade you are, Antiseptic

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I think Antiseptic is closest to correct here. Cartman says and does many ignorant things, despite his leadership abilities (!). I think he likes the sound of the phrase and uses it as he sees fit.

Found this page on Google after a South Park, trying to find out the origin of the phrase. Are we still going with Pink Floyd?

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Ass Hat, how does it make a person a d-bag for looking up information, relaying it, and siting their source?

Also, you're a d-bag for just regurgitating what most of the posters here already said.

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Okay, but I'd like to go back and defend Tork ~
"any of you guys has a handle on this thing"
simply treats "any of" as standing for "any one of", making "has" the correct verb.

It was off topic, but there was no need to beat up on her/him!

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What a bunch of d-bags. That episode was just on Comedy Central five minutes ago. Ironically enough, I actually looked up the phrase after I heard Eric say it (for the 100th time) and I clicked on this link first. The way it goes is: Cartman said to Ms. Chokesondik "Ha ha, Charade you are", definitely in reference to Pink Floyd's song 'Pigs'.
It is interesting yes, and you guys have more than addressed the issue. But this thread is over a year long now. OK?

I also highly recommend you do listen to 'Pigs', which is the point of the original South Park reference. Its about the best Pink FLoyd there is.

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amen to that!

Ha ha, Charade you are

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In this case, "has" is not dependent on whether or not the term in plural. It is dependent on whether you're speaking to someone or about someone. "you guys" clearly means the writer is speaking directly to someone or some party. So the correct word choice would be "have." The only way "has" would work is if tork had chosen to say I "i don't think he/she has" in this third person perspective is where it matters if the subject is plural. "i don't think they have." for example.

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PinkFloyd's, Animals, was inspired, I believe by George Orwell's, Animal Farm. It's a worthwhile read and may shed light on the discussion. Great song, good use of innuendo by Waters, but clearly an indictment against the conservative aspects in American society and for that I think he misses Orwell's point. The left and right have both contributed to our loss of liberty and freedom. The right in search of control and the left in search of a false sense of equality. Nevertheless, I love Animals, excellent!

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your wrong

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no, my wrong

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I noticed this phrase used in three distinct incidents in pop culture. First the pink floyd song. Where they say big man pig man "haha charade you are" In the British accent it sounds like they are singing "sure right you are". 2nd, On an episode of weeds where kevin Nealon's charachter (Doug Wilson) does something to elicit the Elizabet Perkins' character (Celia Rhodes) to yell at him " big man Pig man!" to Which he responds "ha.. Sure right you are". While this is clearly a nod to the floyd song lyrics, it may also put them in context. Maybe "charade you are" is an answer to the the first line "big man pig man" and this of course would mean that there are two voices in the song. Who knows. Last I heard it on southpark. I'm basing this on nothing more than the hunch that the writers for weeds were pretty clever and they may know the proper usage of the phrase. I'm speculating that the phrase may have existed before the pink floyd song and that there is a proper usage that was once known to many and now only known to nerdy sitcom writers. I'm gonna ask my parents and see what they know

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The south park episode that cartman says that is called "Scott Tenorman must die" he is saying "ha ha, charade you are!" I love pink floyd so when I was wathing the episode I heard that and was like "whoa a floyd reference?!" the meaning of that is -haha in your face-

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Pink floyd is dope

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I take the meaning rather literally. with a 'charade' being a empty or deceptive act or pretense, i think it is used addressing someone to insult them by suggesting that they are a deceptive or empty person, like the pigs from animal farm or the people the pigs represent in the song.

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Actually, if anyone cares, this is the actual correct explanation:

"So right you are" was a common phrase in the 1800's in England, commonly used by the upper class when recognizing a valid point in an argument, similar to "touche", as mentioned early in the post. With the accent of the day, it could be heard as "sherright" or "shurrot" you are. This is what Cartman says.

When Roger sings it, he is actually singing "so right you are" roughly half the time and "charade you are" the other half of the time. This is especially obvious in live performances. In some performances, it was quite distinct, while, in others, not so much. The point being to first bring about thoughts of the old English upper class archetype, with its snobbery and elevated language and to then mock it by replacing the words "so right" with "charade."

Grammatically, it doesn't REALLY make sense, but since the phrase was somewhat commonly used, it is clear that its meant to stand on its twist of phrase, rather than its own grammatical feet, as it were.

So right you are? No, you're not right. In fact, people like you are nothing more than a charade. Pigs flying. In some ways, it could also be interpreted as though there are two people speaking in the song, with the upper class Englishman responding to Roger's criticisms with "Ha ha, so right you are" and Roger later responding mockingly with "Ha ha, charade YOU are."

Get it?

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Josh -

Nowhere in the official lyrics to "Pigs (Three Different Ones)" is the phrase "so right you are" to be found.

"Right you are" is a fairly common phrase in England. Any "so" is merely incidental. Just as often you'll hear "how right you are" or "well, right you are" or "rightcha'are, guvna!"

Get it?

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Josh, I would disagree with your suggestion that "so right you are" is ungrammatical. I think that turn of phrase is similar to the following. Imagine a child who is a finicky eater. After devouring a nutritious meal, one of his parent's says "My, how well you have eaten, Johnny!" as opposed to "You have eaten well, Johnny!" I suppose one could make a case that the former is a fragment and should be "Look how well you have eaten" or something. The "look" could be considered to be elided.

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"Grandma, what big eyes you have!" = "Grandma, you have big eyes!"

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I watched the episode (when Cartman fed Scott Tennermin his parents with Eric's homemade chili) where Cartman says "Ha Ha charade you are Scott". He also says it in two other episodes and in no way were either making fun of Pink Floyd (greatest band ever) so what's your proof & why would South Park writers make fun of a band who has rarely if ever been in the spotlight. I wouldn't laugh had it been in that context because it's not funny. Look how they made fun of Rod Stewart, Kenny-G, Metallica, Brittany Spears because they are easy targets, Floyd...not so much. Thanks you!

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This phrase takes no thought at all. It means "Ha, you're clever, but I know you're a phony!". And yes, Cartman does say this, he doesn't say "So right you are" (wtf?)

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I still agree with Tork, in substance and form. Specifically, I am in agreement with his own subject-verb agreement.
I am glad to see so many people take an interest in grammar, but most of you are simply taking what you are familiar with and declaring it law. If you wish to be a descriptivist, fine, then shut up, because nobody's wrong. If you favor proscriptive grammar, then get it right.
Finally, Animal Farm, especially as an avatar for 1984, is not about religion. It is about totalitarian collectivism. Merely saying a thing does not make it so. Charade you are!

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Wave upon wave of demented avengers march cheerfully out of obscurity.

You're all Sheep.

(I mean the question has been answered already and you all are just trying to be clever.)

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Hehe, 6 years later.

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6.5 years later.....WINNING!

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FTW

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Five and a half months is long enough to let this thread stagnate. Personally I think the statement is very clear. I just came here because I was curious to see if it originated with Pink Floyd, and apparently it did.

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you are all wrong
"Ha ha Charade you are" in a song context means "I'm kiddig you", "I confuse you"

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As for the meaning, it's pretty obvious, as porsche and others have said - You are a charade - a fake, a phoney etc, and there's really no need to look for any obscure meaning, especially given the context of the song. Yes, 'charades' is also a game, but this is 'charade', which is rather different.This is from Oxford Dictionaries Online.

absurd pretence intended to create a pleasant or respectable appearance:
"talk of unity was nothing more than a charade"

As regards British pronunciation, it's not so much 'sha-rahd' as 'she-rahd' - /ʃəˈrɑːd/ in IPA - which is exactly how Walters sings it.

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