Plural of name ending in Y

@MBS - Forget my last comment. I presume "So I am writing a historical novel" means something like "Supposing I were writing a historical novel" - it doesn't mean you actually are. Anyway, it was quite fun to research.

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Forget Word, Firefox doesn't like either of them either, but the far superior spell check in Google docs, which is contextually based, accepts both. Judging by Google Books, you could go either way, but it seems to be nearly 2:1 in favour of Montgomerys (15,800 to 8,200). There is, for example, "A Genealogical History of the Montgomerys and Their Descendants" by a certain David B.Montgomery.

And while there's an 1859 book "Memorials of the Montgomeries, earls of Eglinton" the Wikipedia entry on Clan Montgomery shows the coat of arms of the Montgomerys, Earls of Eglinton.

There is a further complication in that, according to the Clan Montgomery website, some people have the surname Montgomerie, which would boost the IE figures. Incidentally, that website seems to use exclusively "Montgomerys" when talking of various Montgomery families.

http://www.clanmontgomery.org/links.html

This Ngram graph suggests that the Y version overtook the IE version around 1910, and that the Y version is much more common nowadays.

http://books.google.com/ngrams/graph?content=th...

Small point. If you're writing a historical novel, shouldn't you have been doing this sort of research already?

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Wow! I was looking for a short answer, however I am more perplexed than when I started. So I am writing a historical novel, does this govern how I write the last name of my character when referring to his family: Montgomery. Should it be Montgomeries or Montgomerys? Either way, Word doesn't like either spelling. I liked how "Name ends with 'Y' mentioned language is constantly evolving, but in historical terms, do I follow the old rule? Please advise.

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Anonymous is incorrect

http://data.grammarbook.com/blog/apostrophes/ti...

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(If the family name is Clinton.) Are these correct?
1. I'm going over to the Clintons' house.
and what about the short version:
I'm going over to the Clintons.

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For anyone who thinks anonymous might be right, try googling "the kennedies" and you'lll get your answer.

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Though my name is not as common as Kennedy or Murphy, it is one of those fortunate names that ends in a "y." (Notice the correct punctuation with a quotation mark so you can take me seriously.) I wouldn't cause much of a fuss, but still would feel a little insulted if the "y" in my last name was replaced entirely by an "ies." Regardless of the rules, I prefer the "ys" for pluralization.

Plus, I work in the legal field and have a BA in English. I agree with "Anonymous 2" that commonly-accepted writing should control. Language is constantly adapting and changing and to try to force the rules down another's throat is counter-intuitive to remaining current and relevant (the word "ask" was originally "aks" and some today are reverting, by common use, to the old pronunciation and spelling.)

When writing names in the legal field it is especially important to refer to someone with the exact spelling of their name or the opposing counsel can make an argument that you are creating confusion for the court (whether a judge agrees, the other side can still argue it and make you look stupid.)

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Chicago Manual of Style:

"DO use the apostrophe to form the plural of an abbreviation that combines upper and lowercase letters or has interior periods:
The department graduated five M.A.’s and two Ph.D.’s this year.
NOTE: If you leave out the periods, you can write MAs but you’d still have to write PhD’s.
DO use the apostrophe to form the plural of lowercase letters:
Mind your p’s and q’s."

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Do not change the spelling of a person's name to make it plural. How do you differentiate between the plural form of the name "Murphy" and the plural form of the name "Murphie?" They are not both "Murphies." I would definitely go with "Murphys" for the plural of "Murphy."

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There is a difference between correct and commonly-accepted writing. I write for a legal publication and my wife has written for the AP, and both of our employers emphasize(d) that we write for the masses, ie., for a fifth-grade education level (this was more appalling to me years ago, but it fails to amaze me now). Therefore, I use the commonly-accepted form, "Murphys," in writing for my employer. The great writers in literature would use the correct "Murphies."

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Ha--one of the problems with changing an ending *y* to *ies* for names is demonstrated with the name *Mary*, whose plural would in that case be identical to the plural for *Marie*. Mr. (or Ms.) "quite incorrect" is amazingly assertive for one so ill-informed.

As it happens, I live in the Rockies, and was aware of the exception. But I presume that Mr Balboa and others with his given name are Rockys.

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Dear Anonymous,

I happen to be one of those newspaper people you referred to who "should know better."
In fact, I do know better than you do.
I have my AP Stylebook in front of me, which is the gold standard reference book of news writing, and it clearly states that while most words ending in 'y' follow the rule you quoted concerning consonants, proper names are an exception.
Here is what the AP book says:
"Most [proper names] ending in 'y' add 's' even if preceded by a consonant: 'the Duffys', 'the Kennedys', 'the two Kansas Citys'. Exceptions include 'Alleghenies' and 'Rockies.' For others, add 's': 'the Carters,' 'the McCoys,' 'the Mondales.'

Please do your research before denouncing professionals as doing something "quite incorrect."

Thank you.

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Pretty clear here:
http://grammar.quickanddirtytips.com/how-to-mak...

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"'kennedys' is quite incorrect"
For the record, so is not capitalizing proper nouns or the first words of sentences.

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Anonymous is a dipshit. "Noone". LOLAIMLORRL

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What would you do when the proper noun has an even more irregular plural?

For example, would the Mouse family be the Mouses or the Mice?

Would the Sheep family by the Sheeps or the Sheep?

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Nice site man Thanks

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i have my language arts book right in front of me

it says: Murphys

and yes, it actually uses the name murphy in it's example

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THIS IS AN EXAMPLE OF NOUNS ENDING IN Y
donkey
day
puppy
bakery
quality
butterfly
bunny
army
kitty
victory
baby
family
spy
canary
toy
monkey
fairy
comedy
lily
sky
key
candy
city
country
dairy
berry
way
library
copy
tray
community
pony
lady

Date: September 15, 2009
Time: 9:30am

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You guys are hillarious.

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You never use an apostrophe to pluralize, so it would be Konoskes.

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What about the plural of our family name Konoske,
would that be Konoskes or Konoske's?

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Murphys

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I have the need to discern what to do with the Leoneli(s) seizing an opportunity for a publication.

I recall a college English prof telling me not to change the endings on proper names (ie., all the Christys at the party, not all the Christies at the party).

I'm going to go with either "The Leonelis seized the opportunity" or the Leoneli family members or something like that if I don't think it alters the piece too much.

Thanks for your "debate."

We had another good one to contend with a while back: "faculty(s)" of all the schools. I cannot recall if we went with faculties or faculty members.

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i just gave the rule as i know it because noone had answered the original question grammatically.

and btw, james, "y" is not a semi-vowel in "day" it's a silent sound (the vowel sound in the syllable is carried by the preceding "a" and not the "y" which has no sound in this case). y as a semi-vowel behaves like a consonant as in words like "yes" and "yawn", usually when the y is the first letter in the word.

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Murphyes lol :)

The great equalizer: The Web Search
Murphys - 1,220,000 (98.9%)
Murphies - 13,500 (1.1%)
Murphyes - 23 (0.002%)

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Add -s or -es.

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Go for either Murphies or Murphys--both look a tad weird to me, but I'm positive that any use of the apostrophe in this situation is just plain wrong.

Also check out this closely-related thread: http://www.painintheenglish.com/post.asp?id=223

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